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 Exile A_Polar from the community?

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Should A_Polar be exiled?
Yes
64%
 64% [ 14 ]
No
36%
 36% [ 8 ]
Total Votes : 22
 

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ewoLmaS



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PostSubject: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Sun Jul 14, 2013 9:39 am

I think I speak for the majority of the community when I say that I'm beyond fed up with this autistic fuckface. A_Polar is not only a gigantic ruiner and abuser, he is also one of the most boring, uncharismatic and annoying persons I have ever had the misfortune to meet. I don't think there is anyone who doesn't despise him, save a few 12 year olds who are on the same mental level as him and perhaps his mother on the rare occasion that she is sober enough to recognize him.

During the 4 years A_Polar has infected the community he has constantly been ruining games and abusing the power he for some unknown reasons has been able to acclaim. If it's not leaving in the middle of a game, it's kicking someone in an emotional outburst or teamkilling someone for flaming him. He has been warned and banned countless times without showing any sign of will to change his disgusting behaviour and I'm certain I'm not the only one who has completely given up on him.

Although the idea of exiling him permanently has been brought up many times before, people have been reluctant. They have been arguing that it's just a phase, something many 13 year olds go through and that we should just let it run past. After all we can't afford to exile every attention-craving teenager in this community if we want it to survive. Often enough these kids grow up to be normal, functional members of the community in time and thus proving that it's not worth exiling them. Today though, year 2013, it should be obvious to everybody that this is not the case for A_Polar. It has been going on for far too long to be just a "phase". Despite still being in the 5th grade, A_Polar is no longer a child, he is a man grown and behaving like this at his age is a sign that something is terribly wrong. I'm going to put it out clean and simple, A_Polar is not in a teenage phase that will go over in a few months, no he is simply fucked in the head. A_Polar is an autistic, retarded and disgusting excuse for a human being and he will never change. History has shown that it's pointless to give him yet another chance. You don't try to reason with a cockroach, you stomp on it.


I'm proposing that we not only permanently ban A_Polar from all games, tournaments and other activities organized by the community, but also ban him from the forum and all channels. By doing this we will completely exile him from the community and thus completely and utterly rid ourselves of the most annoying cancer this community has seen since the days of Itio.

Now i'm not more stupid than i realize that A_Polar will be back in 5 min on a smurf, after all the freak doesn't have much of a life outside Wc3. This won't be a hindrance though. A_Polar will be left with 2 choices, he could either behave normally on his smurf and therefore no longer be a problem for the community, or he could go back to his natural way of behaving and be thrown out on his ass in 10 sec once everybody realizes it's him.

So what do you people say? Should we once and for all get rid of the disgusting Polar or should we add yet another failed attempt to turn him into a tolerable human being to the thousand other failed attempts? DOWN with the disgusting Polar, for a better, more beautiful STC.
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Shoop

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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Sun Jul 14, 2013 9:54 am

I definently support it. At least until we get an honest excuse and a promise from him to behave better. Then he can get one more chance in my book at least.

But either way the big problem is the admins of the bot. Spoofy, its time to change it to responsible people. Dont let CMK and Jean-mii run sheeptag or we will never get rid of gameruining.
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Fr[o]sT



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Sun Jul 14, 2013 11:34 am

I also support this post. It really is time for it to come, thank you steko ^^ We can all work together to get this guy with the same intelligence level of me, 13 year old and even more rude behavior out of this community, or he changes forever. ^^ Great post. We can do it! cheers 
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Celestial_One



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:43 pm

Support for obvious reasons. I don't need a massive post.
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BaiteN92



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Sun Jul 14, 2013 9:14 pm

"Dont let CMK and Jean-mii run sheeptag or we will never get rid of gameruining."
You'd better thanks them, and CsB, for letting ST active, instead of throwing random flames, for shits cuz u have to feed ur ego Shoop, whereas you and your cie just killed ST by playing DotA over it.
You don't even have to say A WORD about what is ST nowadays, so keep quiet, and let active people take this topic.

It's weird, like, two years ago, me and pab were against polar, then chaise and lakes defended him like SHITS, now everyone hate him ? (Or like him again, aka chaiserae)
Hypocrite community lololol
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Shoop

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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 12:28 am

Ego?
Dota?

I havent played Dota in ages and I write what I think is best for the community, if you disagree say that then. But as long as admins allow polar to continue obviously he is going to...

And what do you mean keeping st alive? ST on Europe have never been in a worse shape than right now. The decline since february when I and some others took a short break is REMARKABLE. Then we had full private games, a tournament and big forum activity. Around then the abuse started, with people like Pab, Jean-mii, etc. And since then it just went on.

I understand a lot of new people think this is the only way it can be. But that is simply not true, throughout the years ST has been kept alive on Europe through responsible hosting. There have always been exceptions. But what is going on now is probably the worst, especially since there is NOONE with direct power even answering.
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Jean-Mii



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 12:42 am

Haters gonna hate forever as liars are going to lie forever (mr Shoop).
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apolars



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:04 am

Shoop wrote:
I havent played Dota in ages.

Neither or have you played ST in ages.
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CHIEFHERO[SKS]

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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:29 am

ofc we're not gonna exile polar lol.

give him the standard ban if he really does ruin games; the same punishment you would give anyone else for afking/leaving/whatever. noone cares if people polar flames thinks hes boring or retarded. i think hes quite funny for the most part. he has never ruined any of my games either, what exacly is it he does in current st that is so extreme?




rather attack the people who abuse (by letting ruining go unpunished for some). if people constantly get away with ruining, the problem is obviously the leaders/hostbot owners. it's self-evident that polar does contribute to some extent given that there exists many people who like him, and that everyone thinks hes one of the best players today. i don't buy that polar is the only one who ruins, or that he only ruins. but sure, give him a temporary ban if he really ruin games, the same ban you would give cmk or frost for doing the same thing polar does.


we've tried, for years, to promote a community-system where people don't get punished for flaming others, and where everyone gets the same punishment for the same crime. everyone who supports the ideas proposed in this thread are trying to reverse community progress 7 years back in time. wake the fuck up.

over and out.
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Night



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 3:20 am

You can't exile anyone in this community just because they flame. Some people find polar funny/ some a pest. This was the case with many people throughout st history(like itio), but none of them got a 'total' exile, they just got banned for several weeks and most of their behaviour changed. Keep in mind the fact that no one keeps you away from banning people from CsB channel if they spam/annoy you. Behh channel is always open for everyone(except spammers Very Happy).

Thus we come to the fact that banning people for ruining games MUST be a priority for every admin .
If no measures are taken, the community will turn into a rotting garbage can with only trash ruiners/abusers/sewer rats. The question is, hasn't it yet?


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Map

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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 4:28 am

Shoop wrote:
ST on Europe have never been in a worse shape than right now.

No. How would you know? Because people in Behh channel said it?
So far, the activity is raising again. It is NOW better than 2-3 months ago.
Summarizing your argument is irrelevant and not true.
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ewoLmaS



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 6:55 am

CHIEFHERO[SKS] wrote:
ofc we're not gonna exile polar lol.

give him the standard ban if he really does ruin games; the same punishment you would give anyone else for afking/leaving/whatever.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recidivism

The first time you steal you get a light punishment, the next time you steal you get a stronger punishment. The 8976th time you steal you get sent to fucking Gulag. This is how justice works, do you seriously think that a 1st-time ruiner should get punished in the same way as a guy who has ruined on multiple occasions before?

Polar has been punished countless times and he never seems to learn, what do you think banning him for another 2 days will achieve?

CHIEFHERO[SKS] wrote:
noone cares if people polar flames thinks hes boring or retarded. i think hes quite funny for the most part. he has never ruined any of my games either, what exacly is it he does in current st that is so extreme?

Are you seriously saying that you have never seen Polar abuse or ruin? He has probably been banned more than every other person in this community together.

Quote :

rather attack the people who abuse (by letting ruining go unpunished for some). if people constantly get away with ruining, the problem is obviously the leaders/hostbot owners. it's self-evident that polar does contribute to some extent given that there exists many people who like him, and that everyone thinks hes one of the best players today.

There is definitely a problem with the people who are hostbot admins. What would be optimal is to keep a minimum amount of people who can kick, ban and mute and give lots of people the ability to host. As it is now there is so many admins that a ban doesn't really have any power. Whenever someone is banned he will just get one of his friends to unban him in a few hours.

It would be great with a few objective and intelligent people in power who would be very hard to corrupt, people who would be able to treat cancer like A_Polar the way they deserve. Sadly the sheeptag community lack people like this these days and it's probably not possible to fix such a "council". We will always be left with weak-minded and corruptable admins who ruiners can asslick or trick in order to get back into games. This is why we probably haven't had any ban that lasted even a week in the last years.

That's why we have to go with the second best solution. That is to simply exile people like A_Polar who show no sign of learning. There is no way we can get A_Polar out of games by banning him since he will always get back in some way. If we exile him though, he won't be able to asslick his way back / tricking people he felt remorse and changed.

As to your other point, sure there is "people" who like A_Polar, there is also people who like Anders Breivik, doesn't mean he shouldnt be punished. Now i don't really think there is anyone who REALLY likes A_Polar since he is one of the most despicable persons i've ever met. You for instance don't like him, he is one of your most dedicated chess pawns and therefore you pretend to like him.

Quote :

we've tried, for years, to promote a community-system where people don't get punished for flaming others, and where everyone gets the same punishment for the same crime. everyone who supports the ideas proposed in this thread are trying to reverse community progress 7 years back in time. wake the fuck up.

over and out.

It's not a matter of punishing someone who flames and you know that very well. I want to exile a person who has been constantly ruining and never has shown any sign of wanting to change his behaviour. A person who the vast majority of the community hate and would love to get rid off.

Why should we keep a person who barely anybody likes and who only ruins games for everybody. Can you give me one reason to keep him around?
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I_think_I_own



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 7:37 am

Polar should just exile himself from life for getting left back in the 5th grade

And im p sure that i Got banned more than anyone else in this community 0.o
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CHIEFHERO[SKS]

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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 7:39 am

im all in for punishing ruiners. noone has explained exactly what polar does that deserves a permanent exile, MUCH LESS proved it through replays. you're not gonna get anywhere by just asserting that he ruins constantly and has unacceptable behaviour, when i've already pointed out that many people enjoy playing with him today and rank him highly (indicates that polar, at worst, plays serious/his best in a portion of the games he joins).

sure, he has probably left some games or whatever, but who hasnt? the main reason some people dont like polar is because he flames them, not because he ruins their games. there is noone who wants to exile polar solely based on ''gameruining'' - it has deeper roots in his personality, the way he flames others and so on - things i don't believe he should be punished for. you can deny this all you want, but until someone documents/shows what polar does that's so bad, we're not even going to consider a permanent exile.




the reason i want polar around is because i value what he brings to chats, and because i value what he brings to games. i've played alot more games with him than you or anyone who wants him exiled, i haven't experienced this ''insufferable ruining''. I got no idea what goes on in ST games, and you haven't shown us either. do you expect people to take your word for it? much less when you're on a smurf and noone knows who you are, while polar plays ST daily and people let him in their games. perhaps they enjoy every game being ruined, i don't know..maybe you can explain this to me :Dyour whole post can pretty much be summarized by ''i want polar exiled'' surrounded by flames without any real substance.

if polar really ruins games => go give him some temporary ban, i dont care. you better have one hell of a case if you want him permanently exiled though. we'll be waiting for the evidence.
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Chakra



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 9:15 am

The "exiling" from community is, as always, silly.

Why would you ban someone from the forums for what he did in a game? The two are unrelated platforms. Now, if you wanted to ban him from the forums because of his spam/contentless posts he places everywhere, that's different. But, as it is, nothing he does in-game should affect his status on the forums.

Similarly, I don't see much point in banning him from channels for what occurs in game. Channels have shifted away from being solely hubs for playing games, but also as chat rooms to chat about anything. As Amir says, if he contributes to these chats--and isn't sitting there spamming people, etc--then he should stay. His ruining in games is unrelated.



I don't think you, Amir, should be commenting on Polar being banned from hostbots, as you don't play the games. This thread is clearly a call for those who still play. Calling for the posting of evidence when the crimes are widely known and accepted isn't required. Why this was a forum poll I don't know; they never result in anything. All of the leaders of the community who play ST still should get together and hash out a solution. The obvious would be to add him to the bots' blacklists.
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CHIEFHERO[SKS]

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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:30 am

chaky wrote:
I don't think you, Amir, should be commenting on Polar being banned from hostbots, as you don't play the games. This thread is clearly a call for those who still play. Calling for the posting of evidence when the crimes are widely known and accepted isn't required. Why this was a forum poll I don't know; they never result in anything. All of the leaders of the community who play ST still should get together and hash out a solution. The obvious would be to add him to the bots' blacklists.

the simple/fast answer to this is that the people who want polar exiled dont play ST either. but lets elaborate:

i dont care about the hostbots or who gets banned from them per se. but it does have an indirect effect on the other platforms. someone who isn't allowed to play with the community probably won't stick around for the chat. and this is assuming that he's allowed to stick around, which isn't what they want. they want a full exile on polar from all platforms. i use the chatrooms and forums, so why wouldn't i be commenting when exiling polar would have a direct effect on me?

and the more obvious reply to your post is that it doesn't matter whether i play ST or not. you can pretend like JM or CMK wrote my post. deal with the arguments instead of focusing on me. whether im right or wrong is independant on whether i play or not.

and lastly, yes, i think its VERY necessary with evidence when the punishment is equivalent of death penalty. if it's as widespread as you think it is, producing it won't be a problem.





rest of your post was nice and obviously true.
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apolars



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:04 pm

Chakra wrote:
The "exiling" from community is, as always, silly.

Why would you ban someone from the forums for what he did in a game? The two are unrelated platforms. Now, if you wanted to ban him from the forums because of his spam/contentless posts he places everywhere, that's different. But, as it is, nothing he does in-game should affect his status on the forums.

You do realize it's beer that made the acc "A_Polars".

Chakra wrote:
I don't think you, Amir, should be commenting on Polar being banned from hostbots, as you don't play the games. This thread is clearly a call for those who still play. Calling for the posting of evidence when the crimes are widely known and accepted isn't required. Why this was a forum poll I don't know; they never result in anything. All of the leaders of the community who play ST still should get together and hash out a solution. The obvious would be to add him to the bots' blacklists.

It's only people that don't play ST that support this topic and 2 people that I flame (cele and frost). Which proves that this has nothing to do with gameruining more or less they are just emotional cases that can't take a flame.
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XXXandBEER



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:07 pm

apolars wrote:

You do realize it's beer that made the acc "A_Polars".

Yeye everyone knows im secretly a_polar
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Brugges



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 3:06 pm

It doesn't matter if Polar is liked or good at ST. Nor does it matter if other people ruin more than he does.

The only question is should we ban people who ruins games or not? If other people deserve bans aswell then make new threads to discuss that, in this thread we discuss a_polar.

As for the "provide proof" argument this is a classic argument used by people who wishes to kill off the discussion completely. "No eating excessive amounts of sugar is not almost always unhealthy.. Prove it please" this argument are used because its obvious that nobody on this forum cares enough to spend hours of private time collecting evidence of something that is widely accepted and known.

Considering I've heard 3-4 people complain about a_polars gameruins these past 2-3 weeks and I've experienced it myself in the past I would say that its accepted and widely known that he is a gameruiner of gigantic proportions.

Conclusion: Ban EVERYONE who ruins frequently and enjoy a community where gameruining is basically non-existant and where chatparties thrive. A community where people enjoy themselves so immensely that they choose to stay for DECADES.

Or choose to not ban people because they are good at ST or your friend and ultimately end up living in a toilet of a community where you lost half your playerbase to the chess club. A community where everyone ruins for eachother constantly and you have more fun playing badminton with Shoop than playing full ST games.
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Celestial_One



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 9:28 pm

Okay, today polar ruined a game by afking and unafking and kept doing it when he didn't get a team he deemed good enough.
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Night



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Mon Jul 15, 2013 11:40 pm

Everyone (with an iq over a chimp ) agrees that GAMERUINERS should be banned regardless of their skill/personality.. Thats exatcly what i encouraged when i was active but right now RoC seems to be in a very interesting position-> Most people claim banning people would just reduce activity even further and thats why ruiners get away with their crimes.
And thats one of the MAIN reasons Roc community and st nowadays is boring and sickening. Immense game ruiners get away and other people playing just tag along thinking they can't do something about it, thus ruining the quality of gameplay.
But from what i have seen, the bots that st is played in has almost every player as an admin, no ban-system, just complete chaos.


Back to the topic- Until the replays have been posted of polar intentionally ruining banning is not an option.
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ewoLmaS



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Tue Jul 16, 2013 12:40 am

Chakra wrote:
The "exiling" from community is, as always, silly.

Why would you ban someone from the forums for what he did in a game? The two are unrelated platforms. Now, if you wanted to ban him from the forums because of his spam/contentless posts he places everywhere, that's different. But, as it is, nothing he does in-game should affect his status on the forums.

Similarly, I don't see much point in banning him from channels for what occurs in game. Channels have shifted away from being solely hubs for playing games, but also as chat rooms to chat about anything. As Amir says, if he contributes to these chats--and isn't sitting there spamming people, etc--then he should stay. His ruining in games is unrelated.

No they are not unrelated. As long as he remains in the community he will in some way sneak his ratass back in games. History has proven this to be true with many people, for example itio. The only way to completely get rid of him is to exile him from every platform of this community.

But ye another motive would be that nobody likes him. Let's look at the people who has voted to not exile him, ie the few people who isn't certain that they never wanna see his disgusting face again. It is 3 of A_Polars smurf accs, Amir (not because he like him but because he use him as a tool), Night (trolling) and one other person.

STC is not the real world where you have fundamental rights. We can have a much more absolute and deciding democracy since we are so few. If everybody or the vast majority wants to get rid of someone, we should do it.


@Amir and Night. You know that's not possible. There has been no motive to save replays of someone ruining or abusing during the last year since we haven't had a functional justice system where people get banned for ruining. Nobody is obviously gonna dig up old replays so the only way to do this would be to start saving replays from now on and it will take weeks before we got enough material. Nodody is going to bother doing this just to prove something that is widely accepted by everybody who actually plays sheeptag.
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CHIEFHERO[SKS]

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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Tue Jul 16, 2013 5:53 am

the last couple of posts have been the craziest i've read since 2012. lets get this debate over with.

no evidence = no exile. sure, you're going to get 3-4 supporters, but the rest of the community are rational and aren't going to accept exiling a player just because you're mad that the player in question flamed you. polar is staying.





btw, for everyone to know: the guys that are posting against polar all have 2 or more accounts each. they have all voted several times. why do you think they are making new accounts, while everyone who wants to keep polar is on their real ^^ talk about lack of confidence in their arguments lol, having to cheat the vote. the real vote is 5-4, the minority being for the exile and the majority saying ''no thanks''. not to mention the rest of community who is, in effect, also saying ''no thanks'' by allowing polar to play in their games.

thanks for reading my posts, was a fun discussion. i won again. oh, and sure, give a ban to whoever ruins for all i care, just dont 'exile' them, ATLEAST not without extremely good reasons. this thread and debate is not about whether gameruining should be punished, as indicated by the title bruggy Wink hehe
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Chakra



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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Tue Jul 16, 2013 6:22 am

You have some weird math skills:
Poll wrote:
Should A_Polar be exiled?
Yes 67% [ 12 ]
No 33% [ 6 ]
Even halving it, it's 6-6.

List of users recently on:
Userlist wrote:
Chakra 2012-01-21 Today at 10:14 am 349
Runey 2012-01-20 Today at 10:10 am 34
Night 2012-01-20 Today at 10:08 am 129
CHIEFHERO[SKS] 2012-01-21 Today at 10:04 am 597
BaiteN92 2012-01-27 Today at 9:58 am 29
Jean-Mii 2012-01-27 Today at 9:55 am 135
Fr[o]sT 2013-05-15 Today at 9:54 am 49
apolars 2013-07-03 Today at 9:20 am 7
RoguexRanger 2012-12-22 Today at 9:17 am 11
Celestial_One 2012-01-23 Today at 8:41 am 200
ewoLmaS 2013-07-14 Today at 6:35 am 4
TrollPro 2012-01-21 Today at 6:11 am 400
I_think_I_own 2012-02-01 Today at 12:00 am 138
A_polars 2013-07-03 Yesterday at 11:18 pm 13
Spoofy 2013-03-29 Yesterday at 9:31 pm 48
Master[StH] 2012-02-25 Yesterday at 8:26 pm 9
eeNZ 2012-02-26 Yesterday at 7:38 pm 48
Brugges 2013-06-04 Yesterday at 7:11 pm 29
Tameyoshi 2012-02-01 Yesterday at 6:24 pm 6
XXXandBEER 2012-01-23 Yesterday at 5:48 pm 416
Ninken 2012-12-28 Yesterday at 4:04 pm 1
Stooffe 2013-07-12 Yesterday at 5:53 am 2
Shoop 2012-01-20 Yesterday at 4:32 am 742
AthamyRz 2012-12-29 Yesterday at 3:18 am 0
BEeeH 2012-01-22 Sun Jul 14, 2013 3:51 pm 161
So 1/3rd of these are fakes? I see about three, but IDK. Some of these kids got so few posts, might be fake.

Amir, your opinion doesn't matter when banning people from hostbots. Neither does mine or Night's. We don't play. The people who play decide who they are going to play with, this is obvious.
Further, these people don't need posted evidence of Polar ruining. The argument is if he has ruined enough games that a) he is, on average, reducing game quality and b), he won't change. So the people the issue really concerns, those that still play, will be relying on their own personal history with Polar. They'll ask themselves if they enjoy playing with Polar, etc.

The "community," specifically these forums, don't serve as some council to decide matters that no longer truly affect us. If some freak in Germany decides to bomb Berlin, the English don't get any say in the matter, even if the bomber frequently travels to the UK to chat with the queen.
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PostSubject: Re: Exile A_Polar from the community?   Tue Jul 16, 2013 7:26 am

CHIEFHERO[SKS] wrote:
the last couple of posts have been the craziest i've read since 2012. lets get this debate over with.

no evidence = no exile. sure, you're going to get 3-4 supporters, but the rest of the community are rational and aren't going to accept exiling a player just because you're mad that the player in question flamed you. polar is staying.

No the vast majority wants to get rid of A_Polar as shown by the poll. It is currently 12-3 (A_Polars own votes doesn't count) and 2 out of those 3 is confirmed to be people who doesn't even play ST.

We don't need to post evidence if everybody agrees, why would we bother? We don't even need a good reason to exile someone. The only motive to post evidence is to convince others that A_Polar is guilty but since everybody already agrees he is there is no reason to do that.
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Exile A_Polar from the community?
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